Ep. #55 Making a Badass First Impression with Vince Lin

[Angel Donovan]: Hey Vince, it's great to have you on the show. How are you doing today?

[Vince Lin]: I'm good. Thanks for having me.

[Angel Donovan]: That's great. It's kind of funny to hear that you're in San Diego as well. I was there the whole time and I didn't know you were there.

[Vince Lin]: Yeah. You didn't invite me out. I'm sad about that.

[Angel Donovan]: It happens a lot in this industry. People move around all time, so you never know where they're going to be. Sometimes they're right underneath your nose. We'd like to start the show getting a bit of background on you to find out who you are so the audience can relate to you a bit. What is your background like? What did you do before you started getting into the dating advice area and teaching people about this area?

[Vince Lin]: I graduated from college in 2004. I graduated really early. I was 20 at the time and I remember I couldn't legally drink on my graduation day. My friend snuck some bottles of alcohol and we had a good time.

I couldn't really go to bars back then. My only dream at 20 was to work for a management consulting firm. I was taught that was the coolest thing to do. I spent a year doing consulting. I realized the workload was a little crazy. Even though I really enjoyed the strategic aspect of it, I didn't like the amount of work and travel that was involved.

After that, I moved to the Bay Area. I thought as a young kid technology was going to be what was going to change the world and how to make a lot of money. I spent eight years doing that. In the middle of that, some guy completely stole a girl from me one day. He told me about The Game and I read it.

[Angel Donovan]: He stole a girl from you in a bar or something?

[Vince Lin]: I was talking to this girl. He just came in a swooped her and pretty much totally ignored me. I wasn't offended because I was kind of curious. At the time, I was "How did he do that?"

He actually came back and talked to me. He said "Hey man, listen, I know what it feels like. Check out this book "The Game." I thought it was about basketball.

I ordered it on Amazon. Since I read it, everything changed. I started going out with the guys in the San Francisco area. This was back in 2007.

That's when I started into getting good with women. Everything else was taken care of. I had a good education. I had offers from tech firms. Even then, I wasn't getting the results I wanted with girls.

To me, this was a big area. I think I was 23 at the time. I decided to dedicate the next five years I was learning pick up. When I wasn't working at the office, I was learning pick up.

Somewhere in between that I got into the fashion world. I started researching about it. I started looking into it. I was always fascinated by it, but I never really made a career jump because I needed my green card.

I kept on working at several of the large tech companies until that happened. A year ago I moved to San Diego and that's when I got more into what I was passionate about. Now I had my green card. I didn't have to work in technology anymore. I'm grateful for the skills I have in technology and what was taught to me in fashion.

Even though technology paid the bills, I wanted to be in entertainment and fashion. That's the direction I'm going in now.

[Angel Donovan]: Great. How old are you?

[Vince Lin]: 30.

[Angel Donovan]: This could be a complicated question. How many dates have you had in your life?

[Vince Lin]: How many dates? How do you even count that?

[Angel Donovan]: All the times you went out with a girl you met before. A girl, you had her number, you followed up and you met her some other time. Any time you went out on a date scenario. These days we don't really call them dates. It could be a coffee or anything. You just went and did something with a girl.

[Vince Lin]: Let's say, on average, because it oscillates so much depending on what you're focusing on. Let's say on average, every month, you'll have three dates. Then every year you would have 36 dates multiplied by 10 years. That would be 360.

[Angel Donovan]: Spoken like a true management consultant.

[Vince Lin]: Exactly. How many golf balls can you fit in an airplane?

[Angel Donovan]: This is the first time we've had that, by the way. Cool.

[Vince Lin]: How many dates have you been on?

[Angel Donovan]: Thousands. I'm not kidding. I got into it a bit earlier than you.

[Vince Lin]: I have the online dating thing sorted out. I listened to your online dating podcast, which I thought was great. The guy really had it down.

What he's doing as a business I actually figured out for myself too. I had certain messages, templates and certain sites. I'd tell them my profile to a certain site. I have a virtual assistant that handles all that.

Once you have that set up, you can pretty much get two to three dates a week if you wanted. Then it becomes an issue of time management. Just, really quickly, those of you who listened to the last podcast.

The whole online dating scene? You have to look at the supply and demand of the market. Girls get bombarded. Any halfway decent looking girl gets a hundred messages her first week. It's all inversely related.

[Angel Donovan]: There was one girl I was speaking to in San Diego when I was there. She had 1300. She didn't check in for the first three days. She logged in after she'd signed up. She was just like "What?" That's incredible. That's mind blowing.

[Vince Lin]: It's crazy. I asked some female model friends. Even if they sign up for an online dating site, even if they didn't check it, they get harassed on the street, on Facebook, on Instagram. The amount of requests is crazy. It's ridiculous.

We tested a guy model profile on Tinder and Match.com. Nowhere near the response rate of a hot girl.

[Angel Donovan]: No way. It's not going to happen.

[Vince Lin]: We realized if you send messages that are tailored a certain way that one, are set off from the crowd. It actually isn't that hard. Most people don't know how to write messages. Then, two, if you can scale that out.

We wrote an application that auto-liked Tinder profiles. Once you can scale out, you can certain message templates. Once you can scale out your message sending and you have a profile that's somewhat attractive, you can reverse that relationship.

What happens is you outsource the admin work for two dollars an hour. Every week you'll have probably 20 messages back. Of those 20 messages, you can probably get five dates.

Then it becomes you're leveraging your time to a virtual assistant somewhere in the Philippines or India. Now you can respond to girls that actually are interested in you and have somewhat of a commitment by messaging back.

[Angel Donovan]: Yes. It's a completely different approach to dating, of course. Guys make it work for different reasons. It was a pretty interesting episode I found as well.

Just to take a step back to give guys a bit of context on my answer, which was I've been on thousands of dates. From 2001 until about 2005, there were some weeks I was going out to clubs six or seven days a week. During the day, I also had a company training people in pick up.

When you do that, you're working, but you meet all these girls in the clubs at the same time. I just had all these dates during the week. Sometimes I was meeting a couple or three girls a day. It was just really messy for a few years there.

All of it wasn't serious. A lot of the time we weren't taking it too seriously. At times, just meeting girls, and not necessarily me taking it any further from there. Me and my buddies were all into the personal development and the learning thing as well. Because we had the business in training, it put a different perspective on what we were doing.

[Vince Lin]: Did you like the girls you went out with?

[Angel Donovan]: I was totally not in the mode of being serious or anything with any girls. I had a few girlfriends at the time. I was kind of happy with those girlfriends. I didn't meet girls I was more interested in than the ones I was seeing. I would kind of go on dates but none of those would make it to being a more serous relationship or anything after that.

[Vince Lin]: That's quite a problem dude.

[Angel Donovan]: It was a different lifestyle back then. I haven't been doing that for quite a long time. But that's another story.

Anyway, that's a bit of context for that answer so guys don't get confused about that. It's not a lifestyle everyone would want at all. It was pretty extreme. In some ways, I felt some of that time was wasted afterwards.

[Vince Lin]: Yes. If you have a path in life and you're on your journey, if you go on Facebook with people you don't actually like, it's a waste of your time. At the end of the day, you feel like you've been cheated out of your time.

[Angel Donovan]: By the end of the year, you realize time's everything. You become a lot more careful with whom you spend your time, what you do with your time.

[Vince Lin]: In the beginning, you just want to get a date. Then as you progress, you're "Okay, I need to filter my dates to girls I actually will have a connection with, or I actually like."

[Angel Donovan]: The other part that's missing, actually, of my answer is that back in 2001 when I started, there wasn't a lot of information out there. There was a lot of discovery going on. It was a lot more interesting to me from a personal development and self-growth area.

It wasn't like I was reading people's books or anything. We were going out and we were learning stuff. Maybe some people like Mystery and some of the other guys were posting stuff in forums or their books to read, but more in terms of general self-development. The books we were taking and trying to apply. It was a completely different journey compared to the journey people take today, which was more like a self-exploration.

That was probably I spend so much more time in it as well. It stayed interesting because it was all a mystery still. There wasn't anything written down about it. I felt like I was discovering new things.

[Vince Lin]: It was a mystery before mystery.

[Angel Donovan]: Right. How many relationships have you had, or been in, or that something you do?

[Vince Lin]: Serious relationships, like a girlfriend?

[Angel Donovan]: Let's say three months or longer. What would you consider a relationship?

[Vince Lin]: In my mind, I've had three serious relationships. I don't know if you want me to go into them.

[Angel Donovan]: Just a quick overview how long were they and were you exclusive, non-exclusive?

[Vince Lin]: I've always been exclusive. My first relationship was about a year. That was the girl I first really liked after I was learning how to pick up girls and gaining more success with women. I stayed with her for a year.

The second one was eight months. She really loved me. I thought I did at the time. I realized later on I loved her but not in a way where I wanted to spend the rest of my life with her.

The last one I really fell in love with and, unfortunately, she loved me too but there was a difference in our lifestyle. In some ways, it was related to religion. Those are my three relationships so far.

I would say up until the last one, I didn't really know what it was like to completely commit to the person and to be in love with them unconditionally. We develop subconsciously this shield that needs to be had in pick up. You are talking to so many people and you just don't know how someone is going to respond.

You're doing "approach pick up." In order to be that type of player, you have to have a psychic shield up to your vulnerabilities. Otherwise, you will just get destroyed.

I realize I had that shield and she was the first person that was able to call my BS and break down that shield. For the first time, I was very vulnerable. It was nice to be able to realize I was capable of that kind of love.

For me, it was a learning experience. Even though it was very painful, it was a great learning experience. I realize a lot of guys who study how to succeed with women ironically don't have that ability. Or they have that ability but they don't know how to tap into it. That's the dark side of game.

[Angel Donovan]: Yes I agree. That's the place where many guys get stuck.

[Vince Lin]: Honestly, a lot of guys I talk to, and I've coached and hung out with many of the people in our industry. Most guys just want a girl of their choice that they can fall deeply in love with. I think that is one of the most rewarding experiences of this life. You'd be lucky to find someone who can love you back the same way.

[Angel Donovan]: I think we covered in our last podcast, but people get a little bit distracted by the other guys in the communities, in the forums. It could be ego gets in the way a bit. That's why some guys turn into players and they weren't destines to become a player.

They first found out about this stuff and they thought "Great because I'm not getting into any relationship with the kind of girl I want to be with" or "I'm not getting any luck with girls," so they say "Great, I'll learn about this."

Then they start to get distracted and they start becoming a player. There are some guys I think are kind of destined for that anyway because they are on a different level biologically and mentally. But there's many guys, like you said, like the majority who aren't destined for that. Sometimes they get pushed that way because of distraction.

[Vince Lin]: Yes. I would tell younger guys who were doing this. I know they ask me sometimes for advice. I would say trot out your own goal. Don't get stuck with the goals of other people. Some people are built that way. They like to have sex a lot and they like having sex with different people. By all means, that's fine.

You should focus on your ability to get the girls you want. If you like a girl and you see nothing wrong with her, keep dating her. The knowledge is always there. You can always come back and relearn this stuff. We're not back in 2001 where the information wasn't available.

Now a lot of people know how to come up with a process to build up these skills to meet women. You can spend time in a relationship to see if you really love this girl. You can always come back and relearn game.

On the other hand, if you decide to just learn game and you want to spend a year doing it, that's fine too. But be aware. Be honest with your communication with the girls you're dating that this is your priority, so she doesn't get led on. Especially older girls, because they have more of a biological clock than we do. I didn't really appreciate that.

I was always a young kid. Now that I'm 30, I'm a little bit more cognizant. If a girl's turning 30 or she's in her late twenties, I don't waste her time too much.

[Angel Donovan]: Right. Well said. How many girls have you slept with to date?

[Vince Lin]: I promised myself I wouldn't talk about it, but enough to know what I would be missing if I got married. I've probably slept with all the types of girls I really wanted to sleep with. It's been a nice. It's been a good journey but sex to me is not as important as it used to be. I'll just put it that way.

[Angel Donovan]: Good answer. What's your dating and relationship lifestyle like today?

[Vince Lin]: Right now I'm dating to get married. I want to have a family and kids. It took me a while to admit that to myself, especially when you're considered someone who's been doing pick up. Other people ask you for advice. You're almost not supposed to say that.

That's my goal, so for me, to able to choose the girl that I want can be a very noble thing to do. Right now, I try to do one or two dates a week, if possible. Some weeks I'll be working too much, or I'll be hanging out with friends and I'll skip that.

If I'm working a lot, usually my dates come from online. If I'm not working that much, and I have time to go out, I'll have numbers from going out. If I go to a fashion show, usually I'll get a few contacts from the girls there. We end up being friends or we end up hanging out.

A lot of the model girls, because I'm in the industry, we try to just be friends and see how it goes. For female models, and some of the male models too, they have so many options. For them, it's not about just getting laid. For them, it's about finding someone who has more value than just sex.

A lot of the female models, if you want to date them, you actually have to hang out with them for a bit and get to know them. Sometimes they just want to date. But for the most part, they have their pick of the litter.

I'm hanging out with female models, going out on dates. Sometimes we meet people through a cold approach. I try to stay sharp. I try to go out once a week for cold approach, but sometimes I don't have time. I enjoy the process. For me, it's fun.

[Angel Donovan]: Excellent. So you're looking for that one important relationship basically.

[Vince Lin]: I think so, yes. The girls I'm dating now, I don't tell them directly, but I'm very honest with my intent. I don't call them too much if I don't have to. I know what it feels like not to find the girl you really love from my last relationship. I'm looking for that in my future relationships.

That's going to be my goal going forward.

[Angel Donovan]: Okay, let's get into today's topic, which is all about style and image. We got you on here because you're one of the few pick up artists who really look to that subject. You got your book about it.

Most of the guys talk about it a bit, but they haven't gone into it in as much depth. They certainly haven't written specific books about the topic. Let's give the audience a clearer idea of what we're talking about. What is style? What is image?

[Vince Lin]: If you think about style, a lot of guys either have no conception of what style means or they may have an interpretation of style based on what they read from GQ, or what they've seen on TV. For me, style is a super-power, so to speak. You can use style to represent who you are as a person.

Let me just back up a bit and give you some context. For me, before I got into pick up, I was so fascinated with the modeling industry. I'm very tall. I'm Taiwanese and I'm six two. When I was in high school, people said, "Oh Vince, you're really skinny, but if you worked out, you would have a good frame."

I always had a good frame. I always wondered what it would be like to be a model, but I never really pursued it. I was always kind of a nerd and studied a lot. I went that direction. For me, even when I was learning pick up, in the back of my mind, I was always thinking "Is it true that looks don't matter? What about all these all these other things I'm hearing about? How does it work in the modeling world? Do they have game? How can looks not matter?"

That became my burning question I was trying to answer. I was trying to answer that for a few years while I was learning game. While I was learning game, I put that aside. I'm like okay, looks don't matter. That's one of the hold sacred cows in the community, so I put that aside for a while.

A few years pass and I'm like, okay, no, I think your looks do matter. Not in the way that most people think, conventional good looks, but related more to your style and how you come across. To me, style is being aware of how you're coming across to people in your day-to-day interactions. Much like a gamer's avatar affects his end game interactions.

You have the ability to express who you are in an instant, within three seconds. In the same way we look at a hot chick and say she's hot, a guy can have a good sense of style and have the same power a super hot girl has when she walks by. To me, that was fascinating. That was like, oh you can actually take that power that women have and reverse it for guys.

How do you do that? That became my whole mission for writing Seducing With Style.

[Angel Donovan]: I think that's a good overview. One of the ways I was also thinking about it, it's a little but tribal as well. If you think back, in different tribes, they see each other. San Diego's pretty good example of that. There's different communities there. You have the surfers, people who are a bit more professional, the military. You have all these different communities there.

I saw that they know each other. They can see each other coming from far away. They dress differently. They have different styles.

It's also this kind of connection point. You're saying you're going to communicate something really directly. It's whether you fit in or not.

While we're talking about this subject today, I think one of the most important things is you don't want to communicate with your style that you're not relevant to the girl you're interested in. You don't want to be communicating things that she's going to say "Oh, he's not within my community. He's not relevant to me because of the way he's dressing.

[Vince Lin]: Yes. It's an interesting paradox here, about the tribe culture you talk about. On one hand, everyone wants to belong to a tribe. In essence, if you have a uniform on, if you're with a group of sailors, that is your tribe. There is an inherent of demonstration of higher value from an elite tribe.

On the hand, you also want to dress in a way that make you stand out. That's the dichotomy here. That's one of the subtleties of style.

How do you dress like you're from a cool tribe? How do you stand out from that tribe? Within the tribe, there's the king, the bishop, the knight. All of them have different style cues that communicate their role within their communities.

The question becomes what type of person are you? What kind of tribe do you want to come from? Then within that tribe, what is your position? Those are the three things you want to think about.

Let me give you a quick example. There are lot of tech start-ups in San Diego. Let's say you're a tech start-up firm and you're CEO of that firm. On one hand, you want to be too suit and tie because they you would be considered a lawyer or someone who a little bit more straight. On the other hand, you also part of a start up, so you want to be cool, hip and a little bit young.

How does that CEO dress to communicate who he is? You can wear dark jeans with a dress shirt. He could still style his hair a little bit more cool. At the same time, he doesn't want to be too unconventional because he's still spending his time in an office.

You can leverage a little bit more edgy rocker, but you still have a corporate Holland shirt and maybe rolled-up sleeves and a tattoo or two. You are leveraging the coolness of your ability to stand out from the crowd. You're still, in a way, in business. That's one way you can represent who you are to the best of your ability.

A lot of guys in San Diego, you can tell from a mile away they're in the military. It'd be cool to see a jacked-up guy with a collared shirt and the tie that's not tied all the way. It's like a loose tie. He's fashionable. He's showing versatility. You can tell from his build that he's probably someone who's really well trained physically.

It adds little more dichotomy to that person's look. It also adds a story behind it. People who are asking, wait, this guy is built like a body builder but he's dressed like a businessman. What's his story? I want to get to know more about him. That becomes a conversation thread you can follow when he's out among people who may not know him.

[Angel Donovan]: Right. That makes it really pretty clear. on Dating Skills Review, we've always recommended guys work on their image and their style as the first priority. It's the first thing we say they should do.

But I have this deep suspicion, in fact I know, that most guys ignore us and they don't work on that first. I've always wondered, and I know you've been working in this area for a while, do you see the same thing? Do you see guys as interested as working on their image or their style on this aspect? Do you have ideas on why that might be?

[Vince Lin]: That's a really good question. I could tell you from first hand experience with my clients that it's a very tough subject. In a human's mind, their look is so integrated with their identity as a person, especially in Western society. When you are giving someone feedback on the way they dress or the way they look, it hurts their ego a little bit.

It's hard for someone to admit, even for myself at the time, a long time ago, to say "Okay, I don't look as cool as I...or just something I need to change about my look. Maybe there's something wrong about the message I'm communicating with my look. Because it's such a personal subject, it's really difficult for guys to admit that.

I met this one guy who said "I don't want to change my style because I just want to learn game." I said "Your style is your game. It is part of your game, but it's an absolutely essential part or component of your game.

Then you have to ask a question like what is game? If you define game as the outer expression of your inner personality, according to RSC. Your style is the physical representation of your personal quirks and personality. It's directly related.

Your style and game to me is the same thing. I was at a plastic surgeon's office and I remember talking to him about the way he went about it. Just the way he talked about it was so neutral. He was looking at someone's nose scientifically. Here's three centimeters, and blah, blah.

Then, we were talking about my nose and I said "Hey Doc, I'm a little bit sensitive about this." He said "Why are you sensitive about this? It's just cartilage and skin." I realized later on he doesn't care what kind of person you are. He's looking at the standardized metrics for symmetry and beauty on your facial skeletal structure. To him, it's science.

We take it so personally. I have a big nose. I have a big forehead. This doctor, he was one of the best doctors at what he does, but to him, it was just scientific. How do you match a certain shape and size at this angle to have the best proportions and look? To me, that's the same way your style should be.

How do I dress in a certain way in can control that comes across to other people like I can communicate my message now. You have your own billboard. You have your own ad space. You can put the type of ad you want on there every single day when you walk out. What kind of ad do you want?

Don't take it personally because like everything else you're learning, this is a skillset. If you remove your ego from the equation, that's when you start to be able to have more adaptability and flexibility. The power you can have is through your style.

For a lot of clients, the first step of me working with them is their willingness to change. Otherwise, you run into the ego's defenses. It's really hard to get around that when people don't realize that's what's happening. I always take on clients that come to me.

I don't give style advice to my friends unless they ask. Even when they ask for it, I say "Are you sure? Are you positive? Do you want honesty back and advice about the way you dress?" Until they say yes, I don't really give them feedback or recommendations whatsoever.

It's the same thing with game too. But with style in particular, people are a little bit more apt to see it as a personal thing.

[Angel Donovan]: They see it as more personal. You've been looking in the mirror for 20 years, or 25 years. It's not just your features.

You're talking about plastic surgery and your actual identity in terms of your facial features. Obviously, that's really important. But also the way you've been dressing. You've been dressing for 25 years. If you've been within your tribe or community, whatever that is, and you're dressing the same as wherever you grew up, and your friends.

You can see how that's really deeply embedded in your psyche, that identity, who you are. The clothes you wear are an extension of how you look. You've been looking in the mirror. It's who you are. It's how you see yourself.

You're completely right. They have to smash down this identify, which could have been around for a very long time --20, 30 years, maybe longer if they're older.

[Vince Lin]: That's a really good point. You have to keep in mind the other thing is your friends, while they may be supportive, to them it's uncomfortable. Especially if you have friends that are not into self-development, or may not be as ambitious as you are. They will feel some discomfort in your new change.

They may even support you, but there may be a dark side. They may feel more uncomfortable with the new you. You may get resistance, especially in the beginning. If you don't have a coach, some pick up artists may dress a little funny. They go overboard and then they calibrate.

The guy who gets into this will have 10 accessories. A year later you see him and he's more calibrated. He has to go overboard because he doesn't have anyone coaching him otherwise.

You can a lot of negative feedback from your friends, even your family or people you work with. That’s another barrier. But again, anything you do in life that is going to be unconventional, even your friends will support you on the surface.

The human psyche is weird. In a way, it's like if someone lost weight or changed their appearance, or if a model went from long hair to short hair, there's a lot of resistance there for people to accept that change. That's something you have to burrow through.

You remember at the end of the day, they're not you and don't live your life. You have to be brave enough to start that course. Don't worry so much about peer pressure. Of course, that's one of the obstacles you'll face. As with anything in life, anything you do that's going to be substantially different, you will have to go through the social pressure that accompanies it.

[Angel Donovan]: Talking about it this way, I think it makes it easier for guys because once you realize you're going to get this little bit of resistance, but it's not because of you. Your buddies are going to tease you about the new t-shirts or shirts, or whatever you're doing that's different. It's more because it's about their discomfort rather than yours.

Once you've heard this and understand that, it makes it a lot easier for the guys to take that step and not get knocked back and say "I put this new shirt on and I got teased so I stopped wearing it. I gave up and I didn't try that again."

[Vince Lin]: I have clients and guys who started getting complements from girls. Their friends almost resented them for it. Well, not resented. That's a strong word.

I would say they were curious about the new responses the new guy was getting now that he was dressed better. Some of them are cool. Some of them say "Hey, I want to learn too." Some of them say "Okay, that's cool. Whatever." Then they ignore it and go back to their normal life.

You're going to get strong responses. Especially, keep in mind in Silicon Valley, especially in the South Bay, you can see a sea of engineers in most cafeterias, even at Google. It's like, okay, this guy's a nerd, this guy's a nerd. You might be the best search quality programmer at Google, but I'm not going to fuck him.

[This is 0:30:50] coming from my girlfriends, not from me. Then you take this guy who's pretty smart already and you get him a pretty cool style. Suddenly, it's whoa, who is they guy? The change can be quite drastic in the Valley.

In San Diego, the guys are more in shape. They tend to have a little bit more style. It's not as drastic. Then you have to focus more on the subtleties of your style and how you can get people to ask you questions or how you can start conversations more smoothly. There's less of a drastic change here. Definitely in the Valley, I think a lot of guys need help with their image.

[Angel Donovan]: Another point I was thinking about that guys may be resisting. It could be a little overwhelming. It's just confusing. What is style? What makes it good? Because it also changes. We were just talking before we started this interview how we both spent a bit of time in the fashion industry.

Fashion changes every year. It has to make money. That's the game.

How does a guy who hasn't got any experience with making an effort to figure out fashion or what he's going to wear. How does he come into that world and figure out this is the direction I should go, this is something I should wear. It is pretty confusing. It's changing all the time.

You could see how that could be confusing and overwhelming for someone. And you say "I'm not sure where to start," rather than "I'll just start here."

[Vince Lin]: You can buy my book. I'm kidding. You know how there's a lot of financial magazines and publications that give you stock advice? If you really dive into the world of stocks, there's two extremes. One is George Souros who day trades. He has a philosophy on how he does that, against the tide and with the tide.

Then there's Warren Buffet who is a long-term value investor. In Warren Buffet's book, he recommends The Intelligent Investor by Benjamen Graham. That's probably one of his gospels.

If you actually read The Intelligent Investor, you will understand the concepts of stock investor at its principle, at the basic. That hasn't changed for the last hundred years. Stock tips and which program to use--that changes day to day. The fundamental principles of value investing has been relatively the same.

Warren Buffet has been able to leverage those principles to become one of the richest guys in the world. The same goes for style too. GQ, Esquire, all these things may have solid tips. If you look at the core principles of style, they've been the same throughout the millennia.

In the book, I talk about style attraction switches, which is a play on Mystery's attraction switches but for style. Then I look at the core components of what makes a guy stylish, irrespective of the fashion trend. These are the underlying rules for style that are going to make you specifically more attractive to women. There are other underlying rules for status and making more money. These are particularly related to success with women.

The first one is dominance. A lot of people mistake dominance for really, really powerful. All you have to show with your dominance is your ability to lead or take control of the situation. How do you express dominance in your style? You could have a very small detail.

The ability to have clean shoes can show dominance. It shows that you are careful and pay attention to the little details. How you properly fit in jackets can show dominance. The basic structure of a power suit has been the same for the last 50 years.

[Angel Donovan]: How do these demonstrate dominance? For example, if you wear something that stands out a little bit from the crowd, is that dominance?

[Vince Lin]: A suit shows dominance because it represents an elite class of workers. A suit shows this person has enough money to buy a suit, although you don't need that much money to buy a nice suit if you know where to go. A guy with sunglasses would show more dominance because you can't see his eyes so you don't know what he's thinking. If he has a pair of shades on that are dark, that shows more dominance.

A guy with a tattoo on his left arm shows more dominance because our powerful brains are wired to respond to certain symbols. These are traits that show dominance. If you take a guy that's really buff and muscular, he doesn't need more dominance because of his physical stature. You have to take into account the client.

If he's really tall already, that height automatically triggers a certain response from women. In that sense, you have to actually tone it down a bit. For guys who are a little bit more nerdy, you want to increase your level of dominance because that's what creates attraction.

Too much dominance actually makes the woman more afraid and intimidated. Depending on the guy I'm working with, dominance is one dimension that they need to focus on and control.

[Angel Donovan]: What would be the simplest thing that something the majority of guys would need to be a bit more dominant? Also, if you think about is like being more confident, expressive, more dominant behaviors. What would be a little tip they could take home and make themselves a little bit more stylishly dominant?

[Vince Lin]: That's a good question. If you've ever watched Californication, the character of Hank Moody, if you notice sometimes he wears a little black bracelet. His clothes are always fitted. This guys in a black shirt and jeans. It's not that complicated but he always..

[Angel Donovan]: He's always wearing the same ones.

[Vince Lin]: Yes, he's wearing the same thing.

[Angel Donovan]: For how many seasons now?

[Vince Lin]: Exactly. Sometimes when he wears his black bracelet, or a leather bracelet, this is more dominance to him. I've noticed that guys who accessorize with a travel bracelet, or maybe even if they have the money, a watch on their wrist, that's a little more. A watch shows eliteness, but a leather bracelet has to do with our hunting days. It immediately gives you a bit more of a dominant look.

Your hair, you can easily spike it and just have a more alternative, hard-care look. Not everyone is into tattoos, but if you are, you can get a tattoo that's well designed and properly placed. It can actually add a lot of dominance to your look as well.

[Angel Donovan]: That's a big commitment there. It sounds to me the way you're talking about dominance is that the more decided you are on how you're going to express yourself, the more dominant you are. A tattoo is a big statement. You put something on your arm permanently.

You chose something that you're going to put on your arm permanently. In a way, that effort to say "This is who am. This is how I'm going to express myself." That's dominant move.

[Vince Lin]: It shows you've made a decision. You're a decision maker. I don't know anything about you, but this person has dedicated a pain and time of his life to get that.

It also has to do with our evolution. I think tattoos show the ability to regenerate or heal from battle wounds. Some unconscious reason girls find certain types of tattoos more attractive. Obviously, don't go overboard. With anything else, you can go overboard.

Even piercings. I know earrings are not so in these days, but a guy who has a certain piercing tends to stand out a little bit more. Again, it's more of a commitment, but that you can always remove if you want to. Or you can get a fake earring to see how it would look first before you commit to it.

[Angel Donovan]: It sounds like the easiest thing would be some small bracelet or something which is a bit of a statement about you and your choice, which is a little bit different.

[Vince Lin]: Yes, totally. Again, these are all related. If you look at the guy and say "Okay. Your clothes aren't fitted. It doesn't matter if you have a bracelet. You need to fit your clothes first.

[Angel Donovan]: Let's talk about the fit. That's key. Your clothes have to fit. Why do they have to fit? Most guys probably think their clothes already fit. I think that's half the issue.

If I think back to my days before I got into all of this, I was wearing clothes and I thought they fit. But I look back at those photos and I cringe. It's really bad. Years later you see what just fits on your body naturally. When I was in the States, San Diego's a little bit of an exception. I think people tend to wear more fitted clothes there.

In other areas, when you're on the East Coast, most people are not wearing fitted clothes at all. I remember actually going to the stores. It's difficult for me to get clothes that fit in the States. I'm not a big guy. I even end of getting the small sizes and I don't feel like they fit. I just say "This is too big for me." It just looks silly.

[Vince Lin]: I'm like that too. I'm six two. I have really long arms and I'm really skinny for my height. When I buy jackets from [Zara 0:38:01], I get medium sizes even though I'm six two because of my body frame.

Why is fit important?

[Angel Donovan]: It's along the same lines we've been talking about. It's just expressing. Are you hiding inside your clothes because they're too big? You can't the definition. You can't see what's going on when you're wearing something baggy and it doesn't really fit.

As soon as you get something that fits, you can see the contour of your body. You can see exactly how it is. You're expressing yourself more. You're just showing yourself for what you are rather than hiding it.

[Vince Lin]: Totally. I would go as far as to say if you're not fit, it's just looks retarded. It just looks weird. For some reason, girls learn this when they're five playing with Barbies.

For guys, we're playing with robots or dinosaurs, and we don't know what fits.

[Angel Donovan]: Right. Just to make clear, this is super common. I don't know what percentage but it's like 90% of guys don't have clothes that fit these days.

[Vince Lin]: Yes. I would say, depending on the city you live in, but on average in the United States, I would say more than 50% of guys have clothes that are at least an inch too big for their actual size. Obviously, a tailor is great. In modeling, you learn about your chest range, your inseam, your waist size. The reason they measure those three things is because the designer when they design their clothes, those are the three metrics that allow them to know the contour of your body.

In other words, those are the fitting points of your body. Whenever a model goes in and they don't have a gown for her, the way they pin the clothes, those are the points they pin it at, right behind your back, on your chest line and on your waistline. Get measured if you have an unconventional body.

A lot of people do, because we're mass producing textiles. It's not weird to ask for customization of clothes after you buy it with a tailor. A guy who is fitted seems to have more social intelligence. Okay, this guy gets it. He has clothes that are probably matching his body contour. It just looks so much better.

I think a pictures speaks a thousand words. If you go on Seducing with Style and just type "fit" in the search bar, you'll see before and after pictures of guys who have fitted clothes versus unfitted. You can see how much of a big difference that makes.

[Angel Donovan]: This is a really easy point, because guys can just look at the movies. None of the stars in the movies are getting dressed with badly fitting clothes. They are get very good fitting clothes. I can't remember the last time, unless it's for a specific role. But if we're talking about the cool guy in the film or the hero, he's going to have a well-fitted costume.

It's not going to be skin tight like Superman, but it's going to be cool.

[Vince Lin]: You what's a good movie? What's that movie with Ryan Gosling and Steve Carrell?

[Angel Donovan]: That's funny, yes.

[Vince Lin]: Ryan Gosling is playing this player guy and Steve Carrell is this loser dude whose wife cheated on him. Anyway, at one point there's a scene in the movie where he throws his shoes away in the mall and he says "Are you Steve Jobs? If you're not Steve Jobs, you shouldn't be wearing New Balance sneakers."

You can see their style. Steve Carrell's character is not fitted. His shirt is too big. His pants are too big. Then you have Ryan Gosling in this suit that's perfect fitted. I think that's a really good contrast. That scene is the perfect representation of fit.

[Angel Donovan]: You said there was eight different points you typically cover. What would be your second biggest one?

[Vince Lin]: Real quick, if you want to ask questions we could dive into it. The second one is identified as a display of eliteness. In every single culture, in a tribe there are certain symbols that are worn by the people that are highest in that tribe's hierarchy, much like a king or a knight might have a certain insignia. A lieutenant who has awards for his war efforts. There are certain symbols that show number one, you're from a tribe that's considered elite in the community, and two, you are of high status in that tribe.

I started thinking about what are some of the signals for eliteness? There are two things this shows. It shows you're social alignment. It also shows your level of intelligence within that social circle.

[Angel Donovan]: Let's take a quick step back. Social alignment. What does that mean?

[Vince Lin]: Why do women find men in uniforms attractive? Why are firefighter calendars selling out so much? They represent a certain social alignment. I guy who is dressed in a business suit. He must be associated with lawyers and other people who have money, most likely.

Your social alignment represents the group you hang out with and the access she will have if she mates with you. This is just speaking on an evolutionary biological level. How represent your social alignments through the things you wear is one big topic.

[Angel Donovan]: So it's like which group you belong to?

[Vince Lin]: Which group you're associated with. You could be a guy on a horse and you're just taking a horseback riding lesson. Chances are, you probably know other people who own and have access to stables. You probably have enough leisure time and money to be able to ride horses. Little things like that.

We see a lot of Marine uniforms in San Diego. Why does this make a guy attractive? He represents a group of people that have been through a rigorous training program and knows how to protect himself. Back in the Valley, eliteness might be being a hippy on Haight and Asbury. Having those glasses.

Every single culture there is a group of people who are considered cool or more outlandish and represents that. I have a tie that has a fraternity label on it. It's purple. Every time I wear that tie, people asked me what the symbol means. Really, it was just a design symbol from the designer.

That's why I like frat symbols. They look so elaborate. What frat is that? Where are you from? Delta Sigma what? If you can score something that represents or communicates the social groups you hang out with, that's a plus.

One last example. For models that show up on set, girls usually have to show up earlier because they have a lot more make-up and hair to do. You'll see models and the guys and girls who've been in the industry a long time, they have a certain model uniform.

They always have a beanie on. They always have a wife beater on, and they always have headphones or a book. No, models don't read that much. They always have their phone. They just seem like they don't care.

It's like they're saying "I'm here. I'm waiting. I've done this a thousand times." Those are usually the models that have been in the industry a long time. Even then, its like this person's a model. They're dressed good but they dress like they're about to change, or they're ready to put on another outfit.

Little subtleties like this show eliteness. And eliteness changes depending on the culture and the city that you're in. The third one is access resources. It doesn't have to be you have a lot of money and drive a Porsche but more like you know how to buy a nice suit. That knowledge itself shows you probably come from a good family, or you've been trained to be a gentleman, so to speak. A little more Great Expectation-ish.

Clean cut is another one. Clean cut is [cell 0:46:22] attraction switch. It's your ability to take care of yourself. I think George Clooney represents this really well. Keeping your hair in check, having your hair done, being properly groomed, having your nails done. All these little details add up.

[Angel Donovan]: That's an interesting one because you often hear women talk about that one. If she's going to complain about something on a date, it might be this guy had dirty fingernails. It's these tiny details guys don't normally thing about and really don't even notice.

When you hear girls talking to each other about a bad date, or the guy didn't turn out. If it was an online date, and he didn't turn out to be something. It will sometimes often be these little things she picked up on straight away that started the whole interaction on the wrong foot. She says "I'm not sure this is the guy for me."

Then the conversation isn't as good. Grooming and all of this, it's getting better over time because we're getting a lot of marketing about it. Do you think a lot of guys need to work on that area?

[Vince Lin]: Totally. I know girls who told me the guy wore the wrong shoes on a date, therefore, she won't date him again. I say "What's wrong with him?" She says "Nothing. I liked his personality. I just didn't like his shoes." I say "Really? That's it?"

[Angel Donovan]: Yes. I've heard one about the wrong type of socks before as well.

[Vince Lin]: Yes. White socks with leather shoes. You know, from a girl's perspective, I realize they come up with these elaborate stories about the guy, if he wears a certain shoe. And I'm like "Why do you do that?" I realized later on..

[Angel Donovan]: That's a good point. Girls will build a whole story about a guy.

[Vince Lin]: Yes. Totally.

[Angel Donovan]: We will do this to an extent. But if it's a guy she's interested in because she notices him, then she'll build up this story even if she hasn't spoken a word to him. She doesn't know anything about him yet. That will often influence how the interaction starts to go and what kind of direction it goes in. It could be a positive direction or a negative direction. Obviously, it's a lot better if it's going to go in a positive direction for you.

[Vince Lin]: Totally. Girls are expert storytellers. He has dirty fingernails. That must mean he have been digging a grave last night, trying to find a body. You don't know what she's thinking.

A guy who's clean cut in all areas is the sum of the parts. It tells a bigger story. In other words, a guy who has everything properly aligned, that guy has a different story than the guy who has some things aligned, versus a guy who has none of the things aligned.

If you think about it, a guy who has the wrong shoes, wrong socks, has dirty fingernails, doesn't know how to style hair. That guy's story is different than the guy who has a properly styled haircut, properly groomed facial hair, the right shoes, the right socks, fitted clothes. Those two guys have very different stories.

To a girl, she's looking at your social narrative. She's looking, unconsciously at least, at what kind of lifestyle am I getting into if I date this person? The guy who is clean cut in all areas, his story is so different than the guy who has some of the things right. IN this case, as with the modeling industry, the top 10% makes 10 times more than 90% of the models. You really have to have this down.

It's not that hard to be clean cut. Have a good hair stylist. Shave properly and moisturize your skin properly so you have good skin. Little things like that don't take that much time. They add up and make a big difference. The margin is small but the difference of the margin is significant. It's an easy fix.

[Angel Donovan]: Clean cut and the incongruence has to do with

[Vince Lin]: How you feel in your clothes. Someone who doesn't wear a suit that often, if you put them in a suit, they won't feel comfortable. You have to feel comfortable in your clothes.

The way you put your jacket on, the way you take it off. A lot of times on the runway, a designer might ask a model "Hey listen, these are my glasses. I want you to show off this particular piece." So then you want to take the glasses off like you've been wearing them for the last six weeks or so.

It's just your comfort level with your clothes and your ability to be congruent with the image you're portraying. If you're new, sometimes this takes a little bit more time. Over time, as you start practicing and start picking out the clothes that represent a new image, you will become more congruent with it over time. This is something you're going to build up as you develop your skills.

[Angel Donovan]: You can actually feel it. When you start wearing something new, you feel uncomfortable.

[Vince Lin]: Totally.

[Angel Donovan]: That's the way it's reflected. Are you feeling comfortable in these new clothes yet, or do you feel

[Vince Lin]: Sometimes the clothes make the man or the woman. The suit might make you feel more, not accepted but almost more on point with your game. When you're in a suit in an interview, you might just feel like you're more on top of your game. Your clothes make you feel a certain way.

There's a study of tribal wars. People who wore tribal masks killed a lot more people than when they went into war because the mask took away their personal individual identity and put them in a group identity.

If you are wearing a team jersey, you might feel more as part of a team. When you're doing something, clothes make the man. Be aware of that too. The more you wear l more classy, preppy look, the more you might start behaving that way too.

[Angel Donovan]: It certainly can help. Again, if you're looking in the mirror and that's what you're seeing all the time, you'll tend to identify with that kind of image. But if you start changing your image, it will help you to kind of shift your perspective and how you see yourself as well.

A lot this is about shifting your perspective. A lot of the guys who get into this don't feel like their social. They don't feel like their good with women and all these things. You have to do this work to shift your perspective and your image can certainly help that. You fit the part if you look more like the guys you've seen in the movies, or wherever. That can help you make you feel that way and feel like you're actually moving in that direction.

[Vince Lin]:Totally. I'll give you one more then you can read the website for the rest of it. I have a long post on Seducing with Style on the Eight Solid Attraction Switches, and you're welcome to it. That's a long post the breaks down all this stuff.

The one more I want to talk about is pre-selection. From Game we know women respond to guys who have other women. How do you represent that in your style? I started thinking about this. Pre-selection through style is how do you communicate that you have other women in your life through the clothes you wear.

I started thinking about this for a while. I think the best way to show pre-selection is to actually have women in your life. In lieu of that, there are things you can do to represent that.

You know how if someone wakes up and they saw their hair kind of a bed hair way, you put gel in and you kind of have the coolest hairstyle at least in this current moment in time. A guy who has pretty cool hairstyle but it's almost like a girl ruffled through his hair. We call it bed head.

It seems like a woman was just playing with his hair. I know Mystery does lipstick stuff. You can have lipstick on the collar. It's a little cheesy, but that's one way to do it.

I have a handkerchief. You can tie it around your wrist and say "I'm keeping this for my girlfriend" or "I'm giving this back to my girlfriend later on." Sometimes when you have something a little more feminine, whether it's a necklace or a bracelet. You actually get a lot of comments about it, especially if you're an alpha guy.

I had a bracelet that had a heart on it but was otherwise a bit more tribal. A lot of girls asked "Is that your girlfriend's?" or "Where did you get that?" It had a heart but it also looks very masculine, like what is it?

[Angel Donovan]: I can see where you're coming from with this. I've noticed over the years a lot of my ex-girlfriends have given me necklaces, bracelets and stuff like this. It seems like girls will often talk about those items more than the other stuff on me. Maybe they see this girl influence on some of the bits you're wearing. Is that where you're coming from?

[Vince Lin]: Yes. Girls can tell if some other girl picked out something for a guy. It's very subtle but they can tell. If you can have a good style sense, you can emulate that. In other words, you can pick out feminine stuff. It seems like your girlfriend gave it to you, but actually you picked it out yourself.

You might be in a dress shirt but you might have a little bit more of a feminine scarf on. The whole sexual polarity thing is really interesting too. Guy models who can actually look feminine to0, even though they have an alpha build, are much more sought after than just guy models who have one dimension to their look.

That's another aspect of it too. It's interesting to have a guy who's pretty well dressed but that he has certain items that seems like he has a woman in his life, or a woman picked it out for him. I have a female friend who went shopping with me who picked out an outfit for me so that might be the case.

[Angel Donovan]: These bits are quite subtle. We're talking about some quite subtle aspects more relevant to more of the advanced guys. For some of the beginning guys they really just need to get started and start changing some of the aspects of their image and improving on it. It's really something I think guys really need to get started with. It's what we call an easy win. It's something that will make a big impact.

If you go up to a girl and you start talking to her in a club, the easiest thing to do is to have worked a little bit on your style and image, and fixed any of the issues you had with that where it wasn't cool for whatever reason. That's going to make all the difference to when you go and talk to her rather than having put all your effort into what you're going to say but you're still projecting this first impression which will just sabotage that.

It's an area I've love guys to get this attitude where they're going to work on it more. One of the other barriers is money. They think it's going to cost a lot of money. Is that something you've heard from your clients?

Is it necessary to spend a lot of money or can we get away with spending a little bit of money on this. A little bit of money goes a long way in this? I know in your book you say $500 is a good budget but do you need that? Some guys, maybe that will be a bit out of their limit.

[Vince Lin]: Yes. It's a fair question. I would think about it like this. You want to spend money based on dollar per style point. Your style point is measured by your response rate from the girls you really want to date. I think of it like that.

A sense of style is not directly correlated with how much money you spend. Even celebrities who go to thrift stores have amazing style. The lack of money you spend will have to be complemented with your style sense. In the beginning, you may not have a lot of style sense.

That's why getting a coach helps, or you can use money to leverage stuff. But you don't want to use too much money. You don't want to become a brand whore. That's like the opposite. That's like have a girl who has too much plastic surgery. It's not good.

I would say think of it like yes, you need some money. 500 is a good starting point. You might even get away with less, but honestly, keep in mind, these clothes might last you five or six years, maybe more. You're making an investment, much like buying furniture. This stuff will last you a long time if you take care of it.

You do need some money to start with, but don't go for the brands that are way too expensive. You can get pretty reasonably priced stuff at Zara's.

[Angel Donovan]: Have you got a recommendation if a guy was going to start, and he's going to buy three pieces of clothing, what would you say he should start with that could make the biggest impact?

[Vince Lin]: It depends on his occupation, his goal of the girl he wants and the city he lives in. It really depends. There's a lot of cultural and local adaptation. But I would say every guy should have a pair of jeans that is well fitted and is somewhat stylish and stands out a little bit. Not too much, not with crazy designs and stuff. Something that stands out a little bit more, like that's a cool pair of jeans.

You don't need to have a lot of money to do this. You can find really cool jeans online. You can find them at thrift stores.

If you want to pay for them, EK has really cool jeans, really soft jeans. Icon also. I don't know if they're still around.

Icon is like a boutique brand that carries a bunch of other brands. Buckle has a lot of cool jeans too. They're a little bit more expensive, but it you find the ones they produce themselves, they're usually a little bit cheaper, about $100, $150. They are really good jeans that really stand out.

[Angel Donovan]: That's like a standard price for jeans these days.

[Vince Lin]: Your jeans will probably cost you 100 to 150 unless you can find one that matches your size in a second-hand store. A lot of times they do. If you have the time, go to LaRossa's or something and just search. That's what women do. They spend all their days looking for stuff. Sometimes you'll find really cool stuff.

You’re trading your money for time. A lot of my clients in the Valley have so much money. They don't have time. For me, come up with a budget and I'll spend the day shopping with you.

[Angel Donovan]: I think jeans illustrate the subtlety you're talking about here because I think a lot of people might look at jeans and say "Well, they're just jeans. They all look pretty much the same." It's the small differences in the quality and the style of jeans which people do notice. People pick up on it. When I was living in Bangkok, the local Thais would tell you if a girl is a hooker or not based on her jeans.

I could see that once someone pointed it out to me. I could see that totally as well. It was where they were getting the cheaper jeans. We're not thinking about jeans and putting a label on. That's just an extreme example of someone who's associating a whole category of society, linking them up to that. I think that happens a lot in the West on a much smaller scale, even though the differences between jeans, we don't think it's a big deal.

It's a good illustrative point of how subtle this can be.

[Vince Lin]: Totally. So the hookers have a hole between their legs.

[Angel Donovan]: There's not holes or anything, just a different class of jeans.

[Vince Lin]: Easy access. Me personally, I like a suit and tie. I like having a white collar shirt and then a black skinny tie, just because it matches so many things. You can match it with dress pants. You can match it with dark jeans. It just gives you a more elite, prep school look. You don't have to wear it every day, but Sunday morning at church, or at a more formal event, it just give you a little more versatility.

I think skinny ties are underrated. They make you look a lot cooler than people that may have standard ties. It's just more fashionable.

A fitted collar shirt, you can always roll up the sleeves if it's warm. It gives you a little bit more versatility. A leather bracelet costs 10 bucks and adds more dominance to your look. That's an easy 10 bucks.

And definitely a nice pair of shoes. You want to have a comfortable pair that you can wear that's a little bit more cool, like Converse. Something you can wear to the beach in San Diego. On the other hand, you also want to have a pair of shoes that are black leather and can match your other clothes, whether it be more classy or jeans for when you go out. That pair of shoes will get you a lot of complements for sure.

[Angel Donovan]: That's another illustration. A lot of guys don't think anyone looks at their shoes.

[Vince Lin]: Girls do.

[Angel Donovan]: When I first started meeting girls in the street, when I was approaching girls, it was kind of a daytime pick up. Back in 2002, I always wondered when you went up and you started talking to a girl, as soon as she got interested, she would look you up and down, all the way to the bottom. I felt like she hovered on the shoes.

I was always really interested in that at first. I was like, this is really interesting. It was back when I was exploring girls. I asked why is that going on? Then you realize this is just picking up on the details.

Then you also think, the last detail a guy takes care of is his shoes. He'll wear some old shoes that are two or three years old. They're battered. He doesn't think it's a big deal.

It's the easiest way for a girl to figure out who you are and if you're looking after yourself. She'll just look at the shoes and she'll think "He's still wearing some battered shoes, so he hasn't got his life together."

[Vince Lin]: Girls are so good at looking past you into your life story because they're evolutionary circuits are designed that way. If they pick the wrong guy and she has the wrong story, she's just pretty much screwed. No pun intended.

They're just so good at the details. I think this is instinctive too. Some girls are not, but overall in general, they pay a lot more attention to this stuff, so we have to have it down.

I think you can fake it, but ultimately it's just better to have a congruent look so you don't have to fake it at all. It's just part of who you are, and there are no cracks in the mirror.

[Angel Donovan]: Thanks for this discussion. We ask everyone who comes on the show this question, so I'm going to run it by you now. What are your top three recommendations? This doesn't have to do with style or anything, just your top three recommendations to men who want to get a better getter dating, sex or relationship lifestyle, as fast as possible. What would you say to them?

[Vince Lin]: I listened to your other podcasts, so I had this ready. Number one, I would say if you have the resources, get professional photographs of you done. You can find aspiring photographers who will do this for free , like or for very little money like $50 an hour.

Have a good setting, have a location and a make-up artist. That's all you need, a make-up artist, a photographer and a location. Take those pictures. Take really professional pictures then take more cool rock star pictures. Those pictures will last you the next five to ten years.

You can use them for your Facebook profile, your LinkedIn profile, your dating profiles. It just adds so much value. The money you spend the value you get pays for it in full and more.

Do that. It's not that hard to set it up. Most people just don't take the time to be able to do that. Really, having studio level photos is going to really help your image, whether it be a professional or social.

We found people that rated other people's attractiveness when they had a red background had a higher rating on average. For some reason, people respond to red in the background. Maybe think about that in your photo shoot.

[Angel Donovan]: Is that a study or where did you get that from? That's interesting.

[Vince Lin]: There's a book called Survival of the Prettiest by Nancy Etcoff. They did these experiments where they have faces of people and they rate them. Then they change out a certain thing. For example, they had higher ratings for individuals who had a different color for their eyes versus their hair.

One thing you could do is just dye your hair a different color if you have the same eye and hair color. They were trying to theorize why this might be the case. Maybe it has to do with genetics, like more genetic variety if you have different color hair and eyes.

Therefore, higher immunity to diseases. They did this study across the board and they found that the same face with a different eye and hair color had a higher rating for attractiveness from the opposite sex. What was my other piece of advice?

If you don't have the money now, that's fine. Keep your money. There's a whole e-book on the science of beauty the actually goes into all these experiments that I wrote. If you purchase Seduction with Style that PDF is free where I actually go into all these studies of what makes people perceive beauty and the scientific studies that went along with that.

For me, that was like an academic paper I wrote but then I realized that didn't fit into the book so it became a separate PDF. If you don't have the budget for it, just start being aware of your image. Just your awareness itself is going to help you plant the seed for changing your look later on.

How do I come across to other people? How do I stand out or not stand out when I'm with my office co-workers or my peers. When I look in the mirror, what do I see When other people look at me, what do they see? Just this awareness itself is going to help you. A lot of women window shop.

If you have the time on the weekends, while you're doing pick up at the mall, just do some window shopping too. Take a look at some of the designer stores and see what you like and what you don't like.

Check out what other people are buying. Just being aware, being at the mall, being at a place where you can buy clothing items. That gives you more awareness. As you become more literate in this language, you will eventually develop the skillset to speak it and eventually to master it as well.

It's going to give you a lot of versatility in whatever it is that you do. It's not going to make you more money per se, but everything that you do will be smoother, more eloquent, faster, and less resistance. That's ultimately what you want to achieve with your style.

[Angel Donovan]: That language metaphor is quite nice. As you basically learn the detail of a language, you become more expressive. When you're a baby, you can't say much at all, but as you get older you get a lot more expressive.

It fits very well because when you start thinking about clothes, it's very basic, like get some jeans. Get a t-shirt. Then you get a lot more detailed and expressive as you learn more about this stuff.

Thanks for those tips. They're great and very original. We have had anything like this before, so it was good.

Vince, thank you very much for taking the time to come on the show. It's been great to have you here and hear your ideas. I really appreciate it.

[Vince Lin]: Thanks. Always a pleasure, and talk to you in a few months. I can tell you how to pick out models. I'm trying to figure that out right now.

[Angel Donovan]: Great. Interesting. That would be cool we'll have another discussion.